A latte with Paige Hoveling

Episode Transcript

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

Hello, and welcome back to another episode of PR & Lattes. I’m your host, Matisse Hamel-Nelis, and I am so happy to have you join me here again today. Before we get started, make sure that you’ve subscribed to this podcast wherever you’re listening to it right now to get notified each week when a new episode drops. You can also subscribe to our weekly newsletter by visiting our website, prandlattes.com. On the website, you’ll find our podcast episodes, plus our amazing blogs, with new ones being uploaded every Monday morning. And, of course, make sure you’re following us on Instagram @PRAndLattes. And on LinkedIn, PR & Lattes.

Today I’m chatting with Paige Hoveling, the government relations and communications advisor for the Nova Scotia Association of Realtors. Paige is a senior housing industry advocate and leader. She has experience in creating and executing communications, advocacy, and engagement strategies for internal and external audiences. A connector to her core, she believes good relationships are the key to successful advocacy and communications. She’s a firm believer that every connection made is an opportunity to learn more, be better, and exceed expectations. And after listening to our podcast today, you couldn’t agree more with this statement. As a mentor, she thrives on connecting with new talented professionals to provide opportunities to improve skills and build our communications industry. It was an absolute pleasure chatting with her about government relations, advocacy, and the various DE&I initiatives within her association. So please grab your latte, sit back and enjoy.

Hello Paige, and thank you so much for being on the podcast today. I’m really excited to have you.

Paige Hoveling:

Thanks so much for having me. I’m excited to be here.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

Yay. So let’s get started. Can you tell the listeners a little bit about yourself and your professional comms journey?

Paige Hoveling:

Yeah. So I have lived in Nova Scotia my entire life. I spent a couple years in Newfoundland for school doing my poli-sci degree, which was foreshadowing for the work that I do now. But ultimately came back to Nova Scotia and I live here with my husband and my six-year-old son.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

Wonderful. I’ve always wanted to go to Nova Scotia and to Newfoundland. I have not been to either. My mother keeps telling me to go, so I’m excited for when that trip finally happens. I’m really excited for that. So you went from poli-sci and now you’re in communications, which people can say, “Yeah, I can see that segue,” but where did your love for communications initially come from, and was it something you always saw for yourself after poli-sci?

Paige Hoveling:

No, it wasn’t something I always saw for myself. I was in my fourth year of university looking at all of the options and saying, “Okay, I have a poli-sci degree, what the heck am I going to do with this?” I knew that I would have to do something else. And I started to think about, what do I enjoy doing? What am I good at doing? And I have been a storyteller my entire life. Some people would accuse me of spinning tall tales, and I have been known to do that. But I love a story and I love talking to people, and I thought, “How can I segue this into a career?”

And then I started thinking about the other adults in my life and what they did and realized my dad is actually a PR person. He was in the industry for 30 years, and I sort of knew what he did, but not really. So I googled, I was like, “What is public relations?” And once I started reading more about it, and learning about the opportunities related to getting a degree, or in my case, an advanced diploma in public relations, I was like, “Well, this is something I could do, and there are really a lot of opportunities related to PR that would be of interest to me.” So it led me to the Nova Scotia Community College and their advanced diploma in public relations, which was quite an interesting process to actually get into the class at the time. There was a lot of writing involved. But once I got there and started attending classes, I just knew it was going to be a great fit for me.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

Going in through school, did you have any placements or internships that you had to do that helped steer where you were going to go once that particular portion of education was done?

And that was going to be my next question based, the fact that your placement was at the Y, sorry, YMCA, if that’s what led you to have a preference for associations and non-profits versus agency or in-house at a corporation.

Paige Hoveling:

Yeah, so full disclosure, we call ourselves a Y family. I have literally been going to YMCA. I went to a YMCA daycare, I went to YMCA summer camps, I was a YMCA junior leader, I actually was a daycare teacher in a past life at the YMCA. So I don’t know that my work placement necessarily influenced my love of non-profits, but I think just the positive experiences I got from being a participant in all of the programs. And I think it goes back to my family as well. My parents were always very much focused on, “You have to volunteer, you have to give back to your community if you’re able to.” And I think one of the ways that I can do that is working in the non-profit field.

Where I work now, we are technically a not-for-profit, but we’re a member association and we operate much more like a business than most non-profits would. We’re also not tied to fundraising, so we don’t need to fundraise to pay the bills. Whereas a lot of non-profits I’ve worked at in the past, you’re doing the comm side, but you’re also doing the fundraising side because you need to raise the funds for the cause, but you also need to raise them to pay your salary. And it’s a bit different in associations because your funding comes from your members, and your products and services. So while it is a non-profit, it’s more closely linked, I think, or more run like a business or a corporation. So it’s a nice mix for me.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

I love that. And do you think that’s a common misconception between member associations versus non-profits, and when they are, I guess, legally or technically a non-profit organization but they run differently that everyone thinks it’s the same versus these specific nuances between them?

Paige Hoveling:

Yeah, I don’t think a lot of people even understand that most professional associations are non-profits. I think for the most part, they think they’re for-profit companies, and I think that’s really a big misconception. I think when folks are talking about non-profits, there are so many different types of non-profits out there, and I think what most people probably think of is the charities, because that’s a big bulk of what we see. Like the health charities, and I have worked in health charities, or there are non-profits that raise money for restoring buildings, I’ve worked at one of those as well. And there are non-profits that are service organizations. So I think a lot of people think of non-profit as charity, but it’s more than that.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

What do you think when it comes to communications in non-profits from different, let’s call them sectors within non-profit, if you will, what do you think are the biggest barriers for communicators, either once they’re in, or to even get into those roles?

Paige Hoveling:

So I think it really depends on the sector and the mission of the non-profit. I think in terms of going back to those charities, the challenge for communicators is really resources and budget. It truly was when I worked in those non-profits, because you simply didn’t have the budget to do the things you wanted to do or necessarily the resources. Often, you are the only communicator, or if you’re a large charity, you are that mall team of communicators. So you don’t often have the resources and you have to do everything yourself. One of the things I say to the co-op students or the students that I mentor through NSCC is that if you want to figure out what you want to do, a non-profit is a great way to do that because you’re going to get to do everything just by virtue of how they operate.

I think for associations we’re a little bit different, again, because we have a little bit of different funding. But I think the challenges that I have seen… I’ve been with the association for almost 10 years now, so I think some of the challenges I’ve seen for myself but for other communicators are that folks don’t really understand what communications does and the need for communications. And so once you can articulate your value and really tie it back to the mission of your organization, and what you do, and how you bring value and get your management on board, that becomes a lot easier. And I have to say, at my association, our CEO and our board of directors really do understand what communications does and the value we bring. And on the advocacy side as well, they have jumped in headfirst 100% all in on that, but I know that’s not the case in a lot of smaller associations and non-profits.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

Something I find interesting when it comes to public relations and communications is that students are taught about government relations and different facets of communications, but they don’t really realize that in non-profit or even in member associations, government relations and advocacy is a huge component to what we do. And during my time at a non-profit that was disability focused, we were always lobbying, advocating for our participants, our clients, for better funding and this sort of thing. So how did you see that role come up for you in your organization, and was it something that you were like, “Poli-sci with communications, my dream job”?

Paige Hoveling:

Yeah. So actually when I started at the association, I started covering a maternity leave for their communications coordinator. That’s how I started. We did not have a government relations position. The communications manager did government relations off the side of her desk. It was something that I think the association, or at the very least our CEO, had realized was really important, particularly in the industry that I’m in. I’m in real estate, and it is heavily regulated, and it is constantly changing. And so there really was a need for someone to do the GR, but it was, again, getting done off the corner of someone’s desk.

So when that mat leave was wrapping up, I got the ability to stay on at the association. The other comms person wasn’t coming back from her mat leave, the director of comms was actually leaving for another position, and so they invited me to stay as the sole comms person, which meant I took over the government relations from the corner of her desk and moved it to the corner of my desk. And once I started doing it, my CEO sat down with me and he said, “You’re really good at this. You really enjoy this.” We don’t know each other very well, he wasn’t my direct supervisor, I wasn’t working with him often. And he said, “I don’t really know you well, what’s your background? Where did you come from, and why are you into this?” And I said, “Well, funny you should ask. I have a political science degree, and my family has been heavily involved in politics in our province since before I was born. I was out putting in lawn signs and dropping off campaign flyers in a stroller before I could talk. So it’s just something that’s kind of come naturally to me and I really enjoy it. I didn’t know I would enjoy it, but I really enjoy it.” And he said, “Oh, that’s very interesting and you’re doing a great job and keep it up.” And that, I thought, was the end of the conversation.

And we ended up in Ottawa at our national conference, much like a lot of organizations, we do a Hill Day where all realtors from different boards and associations across the country, there’s about 350 of them, converge on Parliament Hill, and we have several days of learning and meetings with MPs in their offices. And he had invited me along as the staff person managing the program to get a feel for what this day was like and see what I thought and what we might be able to do with this advocacy work. And we were having a cup of coffee after some meetings one day, and he said, “I’ve posed to the board that perhaps we need a GR person. Would you be interested in that role if it came up?” And of course I immediately was like, “Yes, I would love that. That would be so much fun, but I don’t want to lose the communications work that I do. There are certain aspects of comms that I really enjoy, and I’m really good at.”

And GR is a function of communications. But a lot of the time when you get into advocacy, you get away from some of those comms activities that I really enjoy, like member engagement and social media. I love those, they’re fun, I enjoy talking to people. So I didn’t want to lose those. And so my CEO was generous enough to sit down with me and say, “This is the job description I’m looking at, let’s talk about some of the things you enjoy, and make sure that they’re in there as well because I think you’d be a great person for this.” And so obviously there’s a whole lot of background management, board of directors stuff that happened that was way above my head at the time, but through the process, we agreed on a job description, he put it to the board, the board said, “Yes, that would be wonderful. You have our full support.” They understood the need for advocacy, and the only caveat was that I had to help them hire a replacement in the comms department.

And so I actually helped with the process of hiring our now director of communications, Tanya White, who has been a wonderful friend and my mentor basically since she was hired. And it all worked out really well, but it was because my CO and board of directors really understood that advocacy was more important than just the corner of someone’s desk.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

That’s so important, and so important to have that buy-in. And I know there are a lot of organizations that still have advocacy on the side of their desk because there isn’t the people power to actually do something like that. What advice, I guess, would you give somebody to try to help them get buy-in from their leadership team, if not even their board, to actually weave in advocacy and, if need be, government relations into an actual role versus the square on my desk, this is for that, and everything else is priority?

Paige Hoveling:

Well, I think really, as with anything in communications, it’s tying what you do back to the mission and goals of your organization. So if you can show how advocacy work is going to further the goals of your organization, or how it’s going to contribute to your strategic plan and overall help your organization, that’s really where you start to get the buy-in. For us, it was a pretty easy sell because there were new laws coming out that were negatively impacting our industry. And the reason they were happening was because we didn’t have anybody at the table to advise the government on the impacts they were going to have. And in order to have someone at the table, you need to have someone that can do advocacy full-time, that can’t be someone that is writing all the newsletters, doing all the social media, managing all the internal comms, and then, “Oh, I’m going to drop all of that very important stuff to focus on this.” It’s not something you can divide your time between.

So I think it’s really tying it back to, how is this going to help your organization, and in my case, how is it going to help my members? Because at the crux of everything we do is member success and making sure our members are successful. So I could very easily tie it back to, these three pieces of legislation have been introduced, they’ve had a negative impact, not only on our members, but on homeowners, buyers, and sellers, but if we were at the table, we could have potentially influenced them so they didn’t have these negative impacts, but we need someone there to do it. So I would say that is a good way to influence the folks in your organization. And show them some of the wins that you’ve already had, and say, “Imagine what I could do if I actually had the time to do this. We did this little thing off the corner of our desk, but think about the big picture.” And moving forward, my organization in our current strategic plan, government relations is one of our three pillars. One of our overarching strategic goals is making home-ownership more attainable for Nova Scotians, and we can’t do that unless we have someone advocating for them.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

That’s so true. You need to have somebody at the table to give them a voice. And if there’s nobody there to do it, then governments are just going to assume, and we all know what happens when you assume, so we’ll just leave it at that. Speaking about legislation, Nova Scotia just recently enacted the Accessibility Act, and it’s starting to work through creating their standards and that sort of thing. How has accessibility or IDEA, so inclusion, diversity, equity and accessibility, changed the way you engage with your membership, government, and other external stakeholders?

Paige Hoveling:

So we actually have an IDEA committee at NSAR. It’s one of our largest committees. It’s our inclusion, diversity, equity and anti-racism committee, and it’s about 30 members strong. So they advise us on everything that we do in regards to accessibility, inclusivity, anti-racism, diversity. They have a hand in everything, and we really do bring them in on a lot of things. Also, all of our staff has undergone a variety of training, and we have ongoing training across the idea spectrum. We also include in that, we’ve been doing a lot of education around indigenous communities and decolonization, which I think is really important, particularly in the real estate industry, and with the Land Back movements, and how do we kind of reconcile those things.

And we also, I’m really excited, we are the first MLS system in the country to start including accessibility fields in our listing. So we are in the process of launching that right now, and we have been working with two accessibility folks who do this day in and day out to make sure that we have the right fields in place. So we’re going to have things like, does this home have a ramp, and what is the grade of the ramp? How wide are the doorways? What are the counter heights? And all sorts of fields like that. So our members can fill them in. Eventually they will become searchable on realtor.ca, and people who have varying needs will be able to look at these properties and say, “Hey, yes, my walker can fit through all the doors in that house,” or, “Hey, they have a lower counter to accommodate my mother who maybe is in a wheelchair,” or whatever the case may be, that this home is more accessible than the one next door, or this home will fit my needs, and I think that’s really important.

And I’m just really excited to see the project launch. We are in the final phases of getting all the information on the MLS system so people will be able to search it and view it. But I think accessibility is one of those things that is forefront in our mind and being that it’s Pride right now, my colleague and I have also taken on the task of going through our employee policy manual and making recommendations to ensure that it includes all types of people, appropriate languages, and that we make sure that all different types of families are represented in there. So we’re just getting that project rolling to make sure that we’re putting our money where our mouth is, us as staff are also making sure we are an inclusive, welcoming, open environment as well.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

I absolutely love that. And I was getting a tear in my eye out of just amazement. It’s like a case study of, we started off maybe not so great, not intentionally, just not so great, but look at how far we’ve come and what we’re doing to really push the needle forward, if you will, on being… It’s not necessarily that it’s not difficult, but it’s doable. You just have to find those baby steps to get there.

Paige Hoveling:

And what are the things that we can do? It’s always looking at the bigger picture and saying, “Okay, here’s some really immediate steps that we can do.” You and I met at World Conference last year and I did your accessibility session, immediately we implemented in image descriptions and alt text because that is really easy and why weren’t we doing it? But now we’re looking at other things like making sure our PDFs are accessible, ensuring that we have closed captioning on all of our presentations. So what are the little things that we can do, and then let’s build upon that. And really there is buy-in from the entire staff, board, and every member I’ve talked to has said, “Yeah, why wouldn’t we make things more accessible and welcoming for everybody?”

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

You just make my heart sing with all that. I keep saying, “I love that,” and it’s because I love what you’re saying, and it’s so important for folks to hear that it can be done, and it’s not… Like the movie, Everything Everywhere All at Once. It’s not everything all at once. It’s, you find those quick wins that you can implement right away, and then strategize, how do we now incorporate a bit more and a bit more over time, and become that more inclusive, and diverse, and equitable organization, with accessibility obviously there? Do you find that there’s any component, whether it be stakeholders or some of your membership that are struggling with this? And are you finding that you have to overcome those barriers in helping them incorporate best practices in what they do as a member, or is it just across the board, “We are all in, whatever you’re telling us, we will do”?

Paige Hoveling:

I think it really depends. So the MLS project, we’ve heard nothing but good things. People are so excited to be able to help their clients, because really that’s what it comes down to. They want to help their clients find the most appropriate house, and if there’s more information on the MLS system on realtor.ca that can help them find the right house for their client, that is their goal. So we have had nothing but support on those projects. In fact, we’ve had people be like, “Okay, is this ready yet? Can we use this yet? I have a client who would love to use this.” So on that side, it has been absolutely fantastic.

I know actually we had you do a webinar for our members last year on accessible communications, and I have seen a lot of them start to implement some of those things. I know not all of them. I’m constantly after them. I’m like, “Image descriptions are really easy. Use an image description, guys, or an alt text.” So we’re working through that. There has not been a lot of pushback from anybody on anything we’ve done. I think we’re really lucky in that our province is committed to the accessibility for all Nova Scotians, that we are working as a collective towards ensuring that people feel welcome and safe. We are slowly working on reconciliation activities. So I think it’s very much a culture that we have embraced and we are working towards, so we don’t get a lot of pushback on a lot of the inclusivity or accessibility things that we do.

We do get some of our older members, because we do skew a little bit older, I think the average age is like 55, 56, so there are folks that will come up and say, “Listen, I want to do this, but I don’t know how, and I’m scared of my language.” And so there’s a lot of education in that, and there’s a lot of handholding to help folks get there. But we provide a lot of resources and information too. We include an IDEA fact in every newsletter that we send out, we talk about them on our social, we give them quick tips and tricks to make their comms more accessible, make their comms more welcoming. So we don’t get a lot of pushback, but there is definitely still education there.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

And I think the fact that you and the team have built such a welcoming, and inclusive, and open culture, helps ease those that pushback, if you will, in terms of, “It’s not that I’m against what you’re saying, I just don’t know how to do it and I’m afraid to do it if I do it wrong,” and being able to have those open conversations to get the information to then incorporate what they need to to what they need to do, if you will. So I love the fact that you and the team have worked so hard on this type of culture, and I think that’s a big thing within any organization, big, small, corporate, non-profit, you name it, it’s the culture piece that needs to be there in order for anything, any type of change to be incorporated and embraced.

So with advocacy and government relations being a passion for you given your past education, and now you’ve made it a career to incorporate that with communications and your storytelling ability, what do you think anyone who’s looking for or hoping to pivot the career into something more government relations focused, what should they know and what advice would you give them?

Paige Hoveling:

That’s challenging because, I’ll be honest, I fell into this job. I love it and I love what I do, I truly do, but I was just lucky enough to land at the right place that had the right people in the right mindset at the right time, and that was just luck for me. But I think in speaking to folks who want to get into this type of work, take a peek at the organizations you want to work with, what kind of advocacy do you want to do? Because there are so many different things you could do. And we talked earlier about charity versus association and the different types of industries, so the type of advocacy that you do in those jobs can be very different. And some of them may have advocacy roles already available, and it may be something that you can ease into or something that you can join the specific comms department and start picking up pieces of the advocacy and showing your value that way.

But there may be organizations that don’t realize they need advocacy, and they don’t realize that they need your skills. And I think that’s a bit more of a challenge to get into. The advocacy community is a lot of communicators, but also a lot of former journalists and former staffers. So one of the things I would recommend to folks is, if you’re not too far along in your career or if you’re thinking, “This is where I might want to go,” get involved in local politics, whether that be at your municipal level, provincial or federal. A lot of the people I know that do advocacy work either worked at the legislature, or they’ve worked in Ottawa, or they worked even just for their local city counselor. It really gives you a good base of knowledge for what you’re looking to do.

I also know there are a lot of agencies, and agencies are a great way to get started if you’re fairly early in your career, I think. It’s a great way to do a bunch of different things and really learn the ropes because they always have those senior folks. And a lot of them have, they won’t often call them advocacy, but they’ll call them a public affairs department. And so a lot of agencies will have public affairs department, and it’s a great opportunity when you’re early in your career to get in there and do some of that public affairs work with people, oftentimes in those agencies, who have worked in Ottawa. I know folks in some of our local agencies who have worked in the Prime Minister’s office, and their advice and input is invaluable.

And just get to know the communicators around you. Reach out to some of the folks who are doing advocacy work or who work in an industry you’re interested in. We are such a friendly group, us communicators, and we love to talk. I know me personally, I love when people reach out to me and say, “Hey, do you have a few minutes to talk about what you do?” Or, “Hey, I have a question about how to get into your industry.” I would love to take you for a coffee and talk about what I do. And then I’m one of the people, and I know a lot of my colleagues are, that if we have a chat and I know you’re interested in something, I’ll send you those job postings when I see them. Or if I hear a colleague say, “Oh my gosh, I could really use someone to do this,” I’ll say, “Oh, hey, I know someone who might be a good fit.” So I think not being afraid to put yourself out there and get to know people who are already doing the work is a really great way to get introduced to people and potentially find your next role.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

And I think you brought up a really good point around volunteering. You focused more on the government side of things, but if you’re already in the career, you’re already a professional communicator of some sort and some sector, but you want to pivot, you want to change, volunteering, particularly for something like a member organization like IABC or CPRS, so the International Association of Business Communicators or Canadian Public Relations Society, it’s a mouthful, can provide you with those opportunities to learn those skills that you might not get in your day-to-day role, but you can learn about those aspects by being a volunteer and sitting on boards, or being part of committees, which I think is a great segue into my next question.

So outside of your role, you also hold the Executive Vice President position with IABC Maritime Canada. How do you think that your career to this point has set you up for success for this role and vice versa?

Paige Hoveling:

IABC has been so valuable for me. I was an IABC member when I was a student, and I cannot say enough things. I met so many people as a student member just going to PD and networking. There are still people that I keep in touch with because I met them at an IABC event when I was a student 15-ish years ago. And in terms of professionally, again, it’s the network, it’s a global network. I was just speaking with someone who works in Japan that I met at an IABC World Conference in New York, and there’s a research project that they’re doing, and I was helping them with some of the questions and shaping those. And we had talked about how we could get people to participate, so I’ve shared it with my board because they’re looking for more participants.

So IABC, or CPRS, or any of those professional associations are such great connectors. I know my director here, Tanya, is a past president of IABC Maritime Canada, and she has been with IABC for 25-plus years and cannot say enough good things about it. Anytime she goes anywhere in the world, she looks up IABC members, and she can find a communicator in that community to chat with. And so she has connections with people across the globe because of her time at IABC. And I think some of the things that I have done, I’m an avid volunteer anyways, I think a lot of communicators are, but I have volunteered for a number of local and national non-profits and charities throughout my career, so I think the work that I’ve done with those folks has helped build up to being on the board of IABC and, in less than a week, stepping into the president’s role for our local chapter. I think a lot of the work that I have done with those folks has prepared me for this role because volunteering builds leadership. And I don’t think that anybody can argue with that. Volunteers need to be leaders, and I think the volunteer work that I’ve done up until this point has really prepared me to step into that leadership role at our local board because we’re in a rebuilding phase right now.

I think a lot of professional organizations across the world, Covid hit us all really hard, we’ve all lost members, and we’re all in the process of looking at what our organization is, and what they do, and how they serve their members. And I think the work that I’ve done advocating in particular has prepared me to have those tough conversations with my board of directors, but also with members and potential members about, what do we see as the future of this association and what do we want to get out of it? Because at the heart of what I do day to day is my members, and the heart of what I’m going to do as president of our local chapter is, again, our members. So they just fit really seamlessly together, and I think I understand membership association so much more just from being and working in one for the past 10 years

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

From a non-volunteering perspective, but rather you’re a professional communicator, you’re looking to get something more, I guess, out of your profession, what would you say is the number one, or top three reasons somebody in professional communication should join an association like IABC or CPRS?

Paige Hoveling:

Number one is the network. I can’t speak highly enough about the network of people that I have met in my really very short time with IABC. I only rejoined about three years ago, maybe four. But the network that I have built… I know communicators across the globe that work in a variety of industries and do a variety of things, and if I have a question or I need information, or I need to connect with someone, chances are I can find it, and chances are it’s another IABC member. So I think number one is networking. I cannot stress enough the importance, and what it has done for me and for my career, and personally as well. I’ve met so many great friends.

But I think aside from the networking, the other two things, and I’m going to roll them into one, it’s really the professional development and World Conference. And I know World Conference is professional development, but it is such an amazing standalone event that encompasses so many other things than just professional development. So World Conference, if anyone has not been to World Conference, it is in Chicago next year, and it is going to be phenomenal. Every year I attend, it gets better, the sessions get better, the speakers get better, the networking, the after hours events, the vendors. I’m always impressed with the vendors actually at World Conference. They’re folks I never would’ve met because they don’t have offices in Halifax.

So World Conference, and then the professional development. I know locally, we work really hard to provide professional development to members that is timely. ChatGPT has been a thing over the last couple of months. Immediately we jumped on that and said, “Our members need information on this. How do we do it?” And we reached out to another IABC member to deliver that content. And I think the PD is so essential, particularly for students, because if you’re a student member, our PD sessions are only five or 10 bucks. They’re super affordable, and they’re not always sessions that are geared to students, but it just means you’re doing the PD a little bit of a higher level than you may be at, so you’re going to get more out of it, I think, than a lot of people would because there’s going to be more new information for you.

But we really try to ensure that we have valuable PD sessions, that they’re easy to access, that they’re affordable, and that they’re timely. And I think that’s the biggest one, because sometimes in communications, you go to what looks like it might be a different PD session, but it is the same content. And you can go to two or three sessions that look like they’re different and you’re going to get the same thing. And we really strive to make sure that we’re not just giving you the same old same old, and we respond to member feedback. So I think, networking, World Conference, professional development, like the top three reasons to join IABC, and the top value.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

And I love the incorporation of students with the PD events, because there’s only so much you can learn in school in two or one, two, or three years, depending on what type of program you’re in. We can’t touch on literally every single facet and aspect of PR and current trends, and go in depth. And so these professional development events, I always push my students, “If you see one, attend, because we might only be able to touch on it at a very high level, this is going to go a bit more in depth. And if you were interested in it when we were talking about it in class, that’s the person who specializes in it, that’s your go-to. Connect with them, take them out for an informational interview, network, that sort of thing. So build on what’s happening.” So I completely agree, professional development, networking, and World Conference, highlights definitely. World Conference, definitely highlights for me.

It has been fantastic chatting with you, but we need to wrap it up.

Paige Hoveling:

Oh no, already?

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

I know. But to wrap things up, what would be the one piece of advice you’d give your younger self when you were about to embark on your PR career?

Paige Hoveling:

The first couple years are going to be very interesting. And I don’t think this is just a me thing, but quite often out of school, you think you want to do one thing and you go do it, and maybe it’s not quite what you thought it was, but it’s okay. Don’t be afraid to change. Don’t be afraid to change roles. Don’t be afraid to change where you live. Don’t be afraid to change what you thought your goals were. Because the first couple years out of school are really your chance to figure out what you want to do in this career, because there are so many different things you could do. And if you went back and asked me what I wanted to do when I was in school, it would not be advocacy for a real estate association. But now that I’ve been in this role so long, I honestly can’t imagine doing anything else and enjoying it as much as I do, because I get to help make sure that every Nova Scotian has a place to call home, and I just can’t imagine doing anything more rewarding right now.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

That’s perfect. Absolutely perfect. And also what you just said, helping every Nova Scotian find a home, teary-eyed, again, emotional. It’s a beautiful sentiment, and it’s so true. You never know. When you’re starting out, you think you know what you want, and then you get in there, and it might be what you want, or it might be completely opposite. And being open to that, being open to acknowledging that experience, and then finding what truly is your fit, that’s-

Paige Hoveling:

I think it’s so important to just take time to think about what you’re doing too. Like, “Is this what I want to do?” And when you get lucky enough to work for an organization who trusts you as an expert, and supports you, you can shape the programs that you do. We did not talk about the housing spectrum or attainable housing when I started in real estate, but now it’s at the crux of what we do because it’s important. And I played a hand in shaping that messaging and in shaping that direction. So don’t be afraid to change. And if the organization isn’t a good fit for you, that’s okay. There’s nothing wrong with you. Find something that is a good fit.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

Exactly. So given that this is PR & Lattes, to close things out, I have to ask, what is your favorite caffeinated beverage that helps you get through the workday?

Paige Hoveling:

My coworkers call me a bit of a beverage goblin. I constantly have at least two or three… You can see, I know nobody else can see this, I have two, three right here.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

Amazing.

Paige Hoveling:

The first thing I drink in the mornings is a giant mug of Earl Grey tea. That is what gets me going. But if I want a little treat, I love a London Fog. I don’t do coffee, so tea is where I live.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

T’s more caffeinated in some cases, so that is fine. That is A-okay. Thank you so much, Paige, for an absolutely wonderful time chatting with you today. If people want to connect, get in touch, take you up on the, ask me questions, if you will, offer, how can they find you?

Paige Hoveling:

So you can find me on LinkedIn, Paige Hoveling, but you can also find me across all other socials. I’m @lifewithpugs, and those are the small, flat-nosed dogs.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

Amazing. Thank you so much, Paige. It’s been an absolute pleasure having you.

Paige Hoveling:

Thank you so much for having me. This has been so fun.

Matisse Hamel-Nelis:

You’ve been listening to the PR & Lattes podcast. Make sure to subscribe wherever you listen to podcasts so you can get notified each week when a new episode drops. You can also subscribe to our weekly newsletter by visiting our website, prandlattes.com. On the website, you’ll find our podcast episodes, as well as amazing blogs, with new ones being posted every Monday morning. And, of course, make sure to follow us on social, on Instagram @PRAndLattes, and on LinkedIn. I’ve been your host, Matisse Hamel-Nelis, thank you so much for listening, and we’ll see you next week with a new latte and guest. Bye for now.